Podcast 226: RHONY is SO back; We’re giving Sai the side-eye; CT and Phaedra; Todd Tucker’s Thirst

RHONY is back, baby, and B and Amanda feel like they got the yacht after the season 16 premiere. From Carole Radziwill's Carrie Bradshaw homage to the Martha Stewart cameo right off the bat, there is a lot for Real Housewives of New York fans to look forward to. While the hosts are glad Sai De Silva is sharing more about what was really going on in her marriage, they can't help but give her the side-eye for not being honest all along, and they are questioning her motives for becoming Jessel Taank's bestie. Hailey Glassman was perhaps the biggest surprise of the premiere (not at all what they expected, and they are loving the kookiness). Are CT Tamburello and Phaedra Parks for real? As much as B and Amanda love them together, they have their suspicions. Todd Tucker is not worldwide, but he is releasing a new documentary about his divorce from Kandi Burruss, and the hosts would like one Cocktailer to go see it and report back. Plus, how his other movie is tied to some Real Housewives of Atlanta casting news, and whether Steven McBee's ex-girlfriend Allie Eklund could be getting her own show.

Topics Discussed

• Back to School, Phone Pouches, and Remembering 9/11 — B and Amanda catch up on back-to-school chaos, phone-free schools, and mark 25 years since 9/11.
• RHONY Is So Back: Carole Radziwill's Voiceover and Martha Stewart's Cameo — Why the season 16 premiere felt like a perfect episode, from Carole's Carrie Bradshaw homage to Martha's pie critique and JFK Jr. story.
• Sai De Silva's Separation: Why We're Giving Sai the Side-Eye — Sai finally opens up about her marriage, but the hosts question why she wasn't honest all along.
• Jessel's Lunar New Year Ambush and Why We're Team Erin — Breaking down the Jessel-and-Sai alliance, the Bluestone Manor fallout, and the new cast split.
• New Housewives Erika Hammond and Hailey Glassman — Erika's rented dress and billionaire husband, plus Hailey's Jon Gosselin history and her lavender marriage.
• CT and Phaedra: Real Romance or PR Move? — Phaedra says it's not platonic and CT was her Emmys date, but both hosts have their suspicions.
• Todd Tucker's Divorce Documentary and Shamea's RHOA Movie Drama — Till Divorce Do Us Part, Todd's 10-city theater tour, and the Shamea movie clip that could become an RHOA storyline.
• Could Steven McBee's Ex Allie Eklund Get Her Own Show? — A Bravo viewer survey hints the network is interested in Allie's life in Texas.

Mentioned in This Episode

Sai De Silva, Jessel Taank, Erin Lichy, Carole Radziwill, Hailey Glassman, Erika Hammond, Martha Stewart, Daisy, Phaedra Parks and CT Tamburello, Todd Tucker and Kandi Burruss, Shamea Morton, Steven McBee, Allie Eklund, Jon Gosselin, Meghan King

NOTE: Amanda accidentally listed Allie's last name as Eckhart. Allie's last name is Eklund, and we're sorry for that mistake, especially because we're both big fans of hers!

Frequently Asked Questions

Thank you to our sponsors, Bellesa Boutique and Nutrafol, for sponsoring this week's episode of Cocktails and Gossip.

Bellesa Boutique: EVERYONE who signs up to our giveaway wins a FREE spicy toy or gift card for toys! Read more on bboutique.co #bbpartner

Nutrafol: Give your hair the support it needs. Right now, Nutrafol is offering Cocktailers $10 off your first month's subscription and free shipping when you visit Nutrafol.com and enter promo code GOSSIP.

Back to School, Phone Pouches, and Remembering 9/11

Welcome to Cocktails and Gossip, the podcast where we drink cocktails, but you better believe we're gonna spill the tea. We chat reality TV, celebrity blinds, and the hottest tea from BravoAndCocktails.com. And as always, it's all alleged and just for fun. We do not verify our blinds. I'm B. And I'm Amanda. Let's get into this week's tea.

What's up, Cocktailers? What's up, Amanda?

Hi, B. Hi, Cocktailers. I mean, a lot's up. We are so back in the swing of things. How's it going? How we doing out there, moms? You guys start everything a little later than we do in my household because of the way your school timings work. Are you guys surviving?

It's especially late this year because Labor Day was late. You know what it is: it's just up earlier, out earlier, and who doesn't have a practice? Who doesn't have the orthodontist?

Same. My older kid has a no-texting-at-school policy, which I think is overall really good.

No phones at school by us at all. Big time, they take it away.

That's what they're doing here too. I guess we're just late to the party.

By us, they have to put it in pouches, and here's the scary thing. I'm fortunate because we drop our kids at school, so I know my kid's in the school building. But once you put the phone in the pouch, you're there. We all track our kids, right? So let's say my daughter put the phone in the pouch at home or on the school bus. Her location would still be there. I found that out from a friend whose child takes the school bus, and they were like, "Why are they on this block for an hour?" They called the school, and the school found the kid. The kid's in school. But it's a little dicey.

Does each kid carry their own pouch? How does that work?

Yes. Each child is given a pouch. If they lose the pouch, they have to buy another one for $10. You put your phone in the pouch, I think you're supposed to shut it off, and that's it. Nothing happens.

That makes sense to me. I've done that at a comedy show before, where you never lose custody of your phone, you just have it in the pouch.

I have never done it, and I feel like it would give me severe anxiety. But where school is concerned, I very much like the rule, because my kids don't know any different. If they need to call me because they're sick, they have to go to the office and call me.

We're just getting used to it with my older one, because it's a new rule at his school. Things change day by day, so I'm trying to be a little more ahead of it. The worst is if I go to pick up my kid and he's already gone to the gym or somewhere else.

We're so reliant on it, but I tell my kids, "I had to call my parents at work and interrupt their work day to say, 'Hi, can I make macaroni and cheese?'" They didn't grow up in that era. Our parents would only contact us during the school day for an absolute emergency, because they had to call the main office or the guidance counselor. Unless it was "You're being picked up by Jack's mom today," you never heard from your parents during the school day.

Right. And you figure it out. With my younger kids, if I switch with a mom in carpool, we all pick up in the same spot. We have our ways. It just feels a little extra chaotic lately, but everyone's getting into a routine.

I miss the convenience of it. But it's always a good reset for everybody in the family: okay, it's back to school, back into routines.

Well, I have finished my Gilded Age re-watch.

You went through that fast.

I stayed up late. It was bad, but it was summer. I didn't have to get my kids ready in the morning, just myself. I'm obsessed with New York.

I know. And it made me so happy to watch Real Housewives of New York this week. First of all, it's so back. There's something so perfect about it coming on our televisions in the fall. I know it's not technically fall yet, but it feels like it. New York on our televisions in the fall just feels right.

And speaking of New York, I would like to take a moment to acknowledge that it is 25 years today since 9/11 happened. It's so crazy that it was 25 years ago. It's a collective trauma as a nation. Our kids obviously weren't alive, and every year I'm sure you talk to your kids about it. Sending our love and prayers to everybody, because some were affected personally, but every American was affected.

I agree. There's nothing like that feeling of unity we had as Americans with each other, and just seeing an American flag could, and still can, bring me to tears thinking about that day. For those of you who don't remember or haven't had a chance to go, I highly recommend going to the memorial. I took my kids a couple of years ago. We never turned off the news for two weeks, just watching all of the coverage. I wasn't in New York at the time, but we all feel like we lived through it, and I still learned so much there. So I highly suggest checking that out next time you're in New York.

Agreed.

RHONY Is So Back: Carole Radziwill's Voiceover and Martha Stewart's Cameo

So back to RHONY. Carole Radziwill delivering a Carrie Bradshaw-style voiceover about New York City. Amanda, I know you, and I feel like a lot of us viewers, have always felt like New York is a main character of the show.

Very.

And so I love that they really leaned into it with their very own writer girl. She's sitting in the window seat, typing away on her Mac. It was kind of perfect. I stood 10 toes down in the DMs. All of you naysayers that were coming for me, guess what? That was a solid. Was it perfect? Nothing's perfect. I wrote "10, no notes," and everyone's like, "Really, no notes?" I have some notes. We'll get to that. I watched it twice. That's how much I loved it.

I watched it a little later, and I was going to text you to say, "The perfect episode does exist." I thought it was so good, and I knew that you liked it. We haven't really had a chance to talk about the show other than the quick text and seeing your posts. I really loved it too. There have still been naysayers coming out, even in the last week, saying it's going to be a mess of a season. You and I did like the reboot before, but I'm way more excited about where we're starting this season than I have been on any of the other seasons. I have so many thoughts, I don't even know where to start, other than literally right out of the gate we have Martha Stewart. I knew it. I was like, "Martha's going to be on the other side of the door," even though I was surprised that Martha came right out in the first episode.

Same. Of course she's talking. And I'm curious if you believe her story, because she's talking about how she told John-John Kennedy about her surprise that he said he didn't have a co-pilot, and that he told her the Monday before that he was going to fly the plane with his sister and his wife. And of course, before I even get into that, she had to critique the pie, which I would've just hidden. And she did not care for one of the decor pieces at Daisy's apartment, which looked like a MacKenzie-Childs teapot.

Which is a super fancy brand. I don't know who owns MacKenzie-Childs, but Martha has her own home brand, and I took that as her knocking the designer more than anything. It's a very well-known design. There are all different colors. So I think that was shade. I was shocked that we saw her so quickly in the first episode. What a character she is. I watched her documentary, and I've watched so many things with Martha Stewart, but this is such a different context. I found it very interesting. I did get DMs and feedback that a lot of people did not believe the John-John Kennedy story. First of all, I remember very clearly that Carole Radziwill said nobody actually called JFK Jr. "John-John."

Only the press, is what she said.

Only the press. Do I believe that JFK Jr. asked Martha Stewart for advice about her magazine? Certainly. Do I believe they went to a lunch or a dinner close to when it happened? Certainly. A lot of people felt it wasn't really appropriate for her to say. The poor guy has no privacy in life or in death.

I think it's so blurred. What I will say, and I'm not scared to admit it, is that I am a person who can make a story more fantastic. I like to tell a good story. It's why I like gossip. I don't really see anything wrong with embellishment. I've done it on here a million times. When you, Tracy, and I get together and have a fun night, I can make it a little bit more. I think the story was based in some truth. It was 1999, so 27 years ago maybe. I don't think anybody, no matter how sharp you are, has a great memory from almost 30 years ago. If you put her on a lie detector test, I think she'd mostly pass.

It didn't even occur to me. I had just seen so much online discourse about this specific thing. I don't think there's any reason not to believe her, because you forgot, or the younger folks don't know, what Martha Stewart's celebrity was like at that time, and her power, and the way that magazines had so much more of our attention. Martha's at that point in her life and career where she's Martha f-ing Stewart. She's a badass. It's silly to me that anybody's even spending time on it, I guess including us.

But also, without really knowing Martha Stewart, I think something people know is that she's very particular. Some people could view it as difficult. Most successful women are very picky and critical of things. It doesn't come from a malicious place.

Right. I just think of her as a critical aunt. The one who feels like she can say whatever she thinks because she knows more than you, which is a little bit true, but also very irritating if it's pointed at you, but always entertaining. I also likened her role in my head to that of Kathy Hilton. So I wonder if we'll find her as campy as time goes on, the way we see Kathy on Beverly Hills.

The thing with Kathy that had all of us fooled at first is everyone was like, "Gosh, she really is that kooky," and now we all know she's playing along and doing a bit, and we love every minute of it. It's hard to say with Martha.

Sai De Silva's Separation: Why We're Giving Sai the Side-Eye

Okay. So we had heard rumblings that Sai De Silva was separated. There had been a lot of rumors when she moved to Manhattan and got her own apartment, but even at that point she was still denying it, and we were hearing things before it officially got announced.

She had called out one of our stories. We did an "ask me anything" and shared a rumor we had heard, and she posted a picture of the two of them and was like, "There he is. See? I just don't show him much." She was definitely fighting against the tide, which could have been protecting her children or not being ready.

I want to come back to that specific point in a second. We had a post about them separating at Cocktail Party, and then once the cameras were up and everybody was filming, her husband officially filed for divorce. We heard at the time that it was timed on purpose so that it would happen while they're filming, which makes sense. It gives Sai an automatic storyline, but him filing also gave her a bit of an out when it came to why she wasn't as honest about her situation before he filed. Things weren't good for a while, but on camera during the seasons, they presented their marriage in a really good light. It was good for her to have this out: well, he actually filed, but yeah, we haven't been doing that well, and I was trying to protect him. And back to the point you just made, I'm happy to see Sai come clean and be honest about the relationship, but she lost trust with me as a fan of the show, and she admits it. She wasn't upfront before. It makes me feel like, okay, what else are you hiding? What else are you selectively showing us? What's not convenient for you to share in front of the cameras?

A lot of Cocktailers in my DMs said they feel like she lied to us. But the RHONY reboot first aired three or four years ago, so I don't think when it first started that they were separated or that she had made a decision to separate. She presented him as a little bit older than her, and he was retired. So the fans, us included, envisioned him as a very typical Manhattan thing: you have these guys in hedge funds, or they own a company that they sell and invest well, and they retire in their 50s and maybe do some other business from home. That is not an abnormal thing in Manhattan. She did her influencer thing, so I don't think anybody really clocked it. And to be fair to her, let's say her marriage wasn't in a good spot, but she had made no decision to separate. Do most people go on reality shows and, if there are cracks in their marriage, focus on that? I would say not.

No, and I'm not even saying that necessarily. It just feels like she was making it seem like, "He finally got some work, but it's not enough," and laying it on thick about how much he contributes to the household and how they couldn't do it without him.

It's also a very normal thing for families in Manhattan and elsewhere where the woman is the breadwinner, but she never implied that. She made it seem like he had done his work and that was the main input for the lifestyle they live, not Sai. There's nothing to be ashamed of in being the woman breadwinner, and that's where nothing quite adds up to me.

I'm still a little confused. Let's do some digging. What did her husband do? What was his career? We kind of took it at face value.

He had a bar. And that's so ambiguous. People own bars and they're wealthy, and people own bars and they don't break even. So did Steve on Sex and the City, and I don't think he was supporting that family. But then there are people whose establishments do very well.

I'm giving Sai the side-eye. For more reasons than just that. We're going to get to it. So she was very open with Jessel, and here we are. Now they're close, when I think Sai needed an ally, and I really think that's what that's about.

Yeah, and that makes me side-eye her. Fast-forwarding to another piece of the conversation, for those of you who watched Watch What Happens Live, we're going to talk about that in a second too. It just seems like things aren't quite the way they seem in this first episode, so I'm just watching. And you guys know I have never really been a huge Sai fan, so maybe the side-eye is partially inherited from the way I felt before. But yeah, especially with her and Jessel being so close.

Jessel's Lunar New Year Ambush and Why We're Team Erin

So Jessel throws this Lunar New Year celebration, and of course she says, "Well, I don't want to leave anybody out." But honestly, I think she invited Erin so that she could have her moment to go up against Erin, and she definitely seemed a little emboldened once Sai came and was by her side. There was beef from both Jessel and Sai: one for calling Erin out for blabbing their business, and two, in Jessel's case, that Erin was out doing some real trash-talking with the other housewives at the Roaring '20s party at Bluestone Manor, and of course it got back to Jessel.

Okay, we're going to break this down. I am Team Erin here, and I will tell you why. First of all, on Watch What Happens Live this week, Erin cleared up that during the Ultimate Girls Trip at Bluestone Manor, she was asked, "Who's more fake, Sai or Jessel?" She said Jessel because that's how she felt at the time. She said she and Sai were very good friends. And she was like, "Yeah, I was talking trash. I'm owning it. This is what housewives do. We're filming the Ultimate reunion." Maybe she feels that way about Jessel, that she's thirsty, that she acts like she's something she's not. Is it the nicest thing? Does Jessel have a reason to be mad? Of course she does. But that's what that is. And you could just see that it was an ambush.

Definitely.

And Erin and Sai have serious beef now. I told you guys that when I was at the girls trip, I was chatting with Erin, and there's bad blood between her and Sai, and in the clips we see it gets worse. But at the Lunar New Year celebration, to me it was obvious that Jessel and Sai formed an alliance and planned to ambush Erin, and so I side-eye Sai. Because Erin was her friend, and Erin was like, "Wait a minute." It's one thing for Jessel to come at her, but Sai? That came out of nowhere for Erin.

That's where Sai's loyalties lie: whatever she felt would be the better arrangement, and for whatever reason, Sai felt like Jessel would be a better arrangement for her. Erin picked up on the ambush right away, but she also seemed very surprised that Jessel and Sai are so close now. That felt very real to me, which tells me it's very new.

Exactly. And also, the piece about Hailey knowing about Jessel's IVF: it was a storyline on The Real Housewives of New York. You cannot make something a storyline on a reality show and then be mad at your co-star. Whether she told her or not, everybody knew. You can Google it. So that's hardly Erin telling her secrets. Erin owns up right away. And listen, it wasn't nice what Erin said. Erin is a pot-stirrer. She does have a villain element. But the ambush, the Sai part of it, is what got me, and then Jessel got so angry so fast and kicked her out. It was all too much. Why'd you invite her there if you were so angry? You invited her because it was a cast event, so you could have a moment by throwing her out.

And I'm curious why Sai decided to align with Jessel, because as things stand now, which we know from premiere events and Watch What Happens Live, you had Carole Radziwill, Daisy, who came on as Sai's friend because they worked at Scores together, and Erin. And then at Hailey's premiere party was Hailey, Jessel, Erika Hammond the billionaire's wife, and Sai.

I think that whole thing was so Jessel could have her moment and her ambush. This is going to sound really mean, but I think Sai decided to ally herself with Jessel because she knew she had to do it with one of the two existing housewives, and also because I think she thinks Jessel can be easily manipulated. And Jessel has the direct connection to the billionaire.

It could also be a business move for Sai. Sai is very career-motivated, and that's not shade. I respect that. But I think that billionaire being close with Jessel emboldened Jessel, and Sai liked the looks of that too.

Well, I like Erin. First of all, I think Erin handled it so well. She was like, "Yeah, I'm going. You threw me out. I'm out." That's exactly what I would do. And then I'd go yell at Sai, exactly like she did: "Are you kidding me? You became friends with this girl last week, and you're going to ambush me at our first big cast event?" She handled it perfectly. I'm not saying Erin's an angel and didn't deserve smoke from Jessel, but it was so stupid the way they did it. And the throwing people out, we don't need to do that in New York. Let's not.

I think Erin could have called Jessel after the Bluestone Manor party, which is where so much of this originated, to apologize, just like we saw Heather do to Carmella on Real Housewives of Orange County this week: completely own up to it and say she's sorry. In a calmer situation, where everybody isn't looking at her and she's not being thrown out, I think Erin is absolutely capable of doing that. I like Erin. I think the housewives get put in these positions where they're almost forced to be shady. They get questions like, "Who is more fake, this person or this person?" We see it on Watch What Happens Live. I thought Daisy did a really good job handling a lot of those.

I really like Daisy. I really like everybody on this new cast. I was texting with Tracy about Daisy, Erin, and Carole being on Watch What Happens Live, and how, even though Daisy and Sai worked together at Scores, which is one of the most famous strip clubs in New York...

I have to tell you something. Scores was huge in the early 2000s. Sai and Daisy are a couple of years older than me. Influencers didn't exist back then, but girls who were shot girls or bartenders in a big-name club like Scores, or Limelight, Sound Factory, Tunnel, New Yorkers know exactly what I'm talking about, they were like New York City celebrities. It's no wonder Sai was able to leverage that and become an influencer.

They go way back, but now clearly Daisy has beef with Sai, because Daisy said so on Watch What Happens Live. So there's a big split in the cast, four versus three. Although maybe Carole is kind of okay. There were a lot of looks between the three of them on Watch What Happens Live, like, "Clearly we can't say more." Tracy said this, and I totally agree: it made this implication where Erin was almost like, "You girls will see. All these fans will be on our side after you see what Sai did." So now we just have to figure out what Sai did.

I feel like there are alliances, but the core is Daisy, Erin, Jessel, Sai. Everybody else is maybe a little closer to one side, but they can go between groups. That's what I'm thinking so far. Carole said, "These two are my closest friends." We'll see.

I have to touch on this Jessel thing. She's in the kitchen with Pavit, and I don't know what I thought Pavit did, but I thought he was a successful professional. And she says he's figuring out his career, and he likes food influencing, but he doesn't make money off it, and they still have bills to pay. There is a world where she and Sai related on that. I'm sure Sai told her about the separation off camera. But didn't you think Pavit was a successful businessman? They were looking at those private schools, and she had just gone back to work, so who's paying the bills? Unless she's an heiress, which I believe they hinted at in her first season, and they have a subsidized lifestyle from her parents.

Seeing them have this conversation in the same hour where we hear that Sai's husband wasn't working definitely got my antennas up too. But if you remember, Jessel and Pavit used to live in Dallas, because Jessel was going to be on Real Housewives of Dallas, and I think Pavit had either a high-up position or owned some sort of telecom company, and maybe he sold it. I do remember that Jessel took time off work and then decided to come back. I hope it isn't what it looked like. Jessel and Pavit seem like a really good match for each other.

I do too, and in the last couple of seasons, Jessel has always kind of been like that with Pavit. That wasn't brand new, her being critical, especially with all the food influencer stuff.

New Housewives Erika Hammond and Hailey Glassman

Before the show started, when we were talking months ago about who was going to be on the cast, the person I was most excited to see is Erika Hammond, just because her story is so interesting. She was a founding trainer and part owner at Rumble Boxing, which has locations throughout the country. She married Ankur Jain. They met in class at Rumble. Apparently they were dating other people when they first met, but then a time came when they were both single, and he asked her out at class. They went straight out for a date of martinis and french fries in their sweaty workout clothes, and then they had that amazing wedding in Egypt that we talked about.

Wasn't Ryan Serhant there?

I think so. He's everywhere. That was in April of 2024, and he's a tech billionaire. But the thing I loved about this episode, because we didn't get to see very much of Erika, is that she just says at the party, "I rented this dress." I loved that so much, because that why-buy-when-you-can-rent attitude coming from somebody who could buy that dress a million times over felt refreshing. It felt like the first time we've seen somebody who is truly rich having such a practical attitude. I actually looked for that dress. I couldn't find it for sale, but I found a similar Tom Ford dress for over $10,000.

Holy moly. I definitely have used Rent the Runway lots of times, because you buy these special occasion dresses, you're photographed in them, and you don't want to wear them again. So it makes sense to me. Good for her.

Ankur is the founder and CEO of Bilt Rewards, and I found this really cool. It's a financial services company that allows users to earn rewards by paying rent and mortgages, which is amazing, because I never knew you could do that with rent.

Meantime, we had intel that Hailey Glassman was in a lavender marriage. We included it in a post, but we were very vague about it. We just said, "This season you're going to see a lavender marriage," because we are always mindful not to out people, so that is why we didn't give the details. So there I am scrolling through pictures of her premiere party. Actually, a Cocktailer sent it to me. It was in Meghan King's stories, because Meghan King, formerly of OC, lives in Manhattan now. Jon Gosselin, who Hailey Glassman is known for being in a relationship with, Kate Plus 8's Jon Gosselin, was at her RHONY premiere party, just randomly in the audience. A Cocktailer sent it and was like, "B, is this Jon Gosselin?" I was like, "It sure is."

The early 2000s Us Weekly reader in me was so excited to hear this. I remember being so excited to run and tell you, because I was like, gosh, Hailey Glassman, why do I know that name? Is it the same Hailey Glassman that dated Jon Gosselin? For those of you who were too young, I can't even explain how all over the tabloids they were.

The absolute grip the Gosselins had on us.

Especially when the breakups started happening, and Kate Gosselin was rumored to be dating her security guy. This was a Scandoval-level scandal back then. Hailey and Jon were out and dating, and Jon got this whole new look where he was wearing True Religion jeans with sparkles on the back pockets and Ed Hardy shirts, when he'd formerly been wearing button-down flannels like an accountant. And I'm going to say something that's going to shock you, B. Guess how long Jon and Hailey dated?

Two years.

No, they dated from June or July of 2009 to October of that year. That's it. Because I feel like that is one of those things that will never leave my mind.

Well, he was at the party, so they must have stayed friends. And Us Weekly readers saw them every time they were spotted together for months, so it probably seemed longer, because people like you and I were buying the magazines to read about them. Those were the days when social media didn't exist, so you had to buy the magazine. But also paparazzi would pay for pictures. If Hailey and Jon would meet up for a drink after they broke up, they would make a couple bucks on that. So I'm sure they dragged it out longer as far as the publicity, which is clearly still copacetic, because he was at the premiere party.

I had this wrong preconceived notion about her being kind of bitchy and calculating, so when I heard she was in the cast, I was really interested to see what she's doing now. But I could not have been more wrong. Put her in my veins. She's so entertaining. I immediately loved her. She's definitely kooky, definitely eccentric, and she doesn't seem to care what people think. I was dying when she couldn't figure out how to ask Erin to take her shoes off in her house because she was high. And the pied-à-terre in the same city where she lives, so she can have her own space from her husband while she also dates women. Love it all.

And she's been very open. She said she didn't expect her husband would want to join Bravo. Her husband has deep roots in Martha's Vineyard and no interest in reality TV. He's a descendant of the first Jewish settlers on Martha's Vineyard and has a really big business on the island. A simple Google search shows he's a public figure in Martha's Vineyard. I don't know that they're legally married, because when you Google her name, her and his name come up on a property, but when you Google him, it doesn't say he's married, which doesn't mean they aren't, because he's a business owner, not a celebrity.

I'll do a little digging. There's not a ton out there on him, but they've known each other since they were kids. They met at sailing camp in Martha's Vineyard, and they split time between the city and Martha's Vineyard. The general consensus is that we love her. She's kooky, she's funny, it's great energy. Some people feel like, do we have another person who won't show their spouse? But she's showing us her girlfriends, and she's so entertaining on her own. Check back with us in a few months. Even her refrigerator, and the fact that all she has is protein bars. So kooky. I hope we get to see more about this lavender marriage thing, because I'm not clear if she uses that term because she has relationships with women outside of her marriage to a man, or if he does too. We had that exclusive info, and we'll stay respectful of that situation, but I hope we get a little more clarification.

CT and Phaedra: Real Romance or PR Move?

Other things I would like clarification on: your lifetime crush, CT from The Real World and Road Rules Challenge and all those shows. We know him currently from being on The Traitors with Phaedra. We loved them as a duo and joked about how we wish they'd get together. We never really thought it was a real possibility until she announced on Jeff Lewis Live that they've been hanging out, said it is not platonic, and she was his date to the Emmys, calling him the real prize. What are you thinking?

Okay. I threw my phone. Before I even made a meme, I ran to my daughter's room, because we watch The Traitors together, and I was like, "Castle Daddy and Phaedra are dating." She's like, "No!" We're playing the Jeff Lewis clip. What's funny is they were being flirty on each other's social media in the last few weeks. And Cocktailers know, I don't think we mentioned it on the pod, that we got some random tidbit that CT would be filming for Vanderpump Villa and Phaedra may join him. I was like, "I don't know how that works." It was sort of random. And then she says this on Jeff Lewis Live, and then we see them at the Emmys. Of course, we had that other intel that, not that long ago, CT was married to the girl who does OnlyFans, and then they separated. He was hooking up with Angelina from Jersey Shore, but it was on the DL. He didn't want people to know. Well, Angelina posted on a photo of Phaedra and CT from the Emmys, "Oh, I know all about this. Wish I could say more."

So I have to be honest with you, I'm loving this. My gut tells me this is a PR relationship, because I think Phaedra's very smart. Going into a new season of filming Atlanta, which she was not spotted filming with the group, and having not dated anyone on reality television since Apollo, I have to imagine that the powers that be are like, "We need a relationship." And she knows the fan base loved her and CT together. He's a reality guy. They obviously have chemistry. So listen, could they both be single and think, "This is a fun idea," and they're legitimately hooking up and going to date on TV because they're both reality star veterans? I'm hoping that's the case and it's not straight PR. CT definitely had an attraction to her. I wasn't sure if I felt it from her toward him during The Traitors, but it's also a competition show. Now that they've had time to hang out outside of that, CT is a hottie. He's a macho kind of guy. I could see Phaedra being into it. So I'm hopeful, but cautious.

I really hate that I agree with you. I want it to be real too, but I agree that it feels like it could be PR. I have a few reasons. One, exactly what you said. Phaedra has been so secretive about who she's actually dating. She talks about dating, but we don't get to see it. I also don't think it would make sense, if they really are dating, for them to out themselves so early in the relationship. And it's so not like Phaedra. The biggest one for me: yes, Phaedra likes to have fun and let her hair down, but I don't think their lifestyles really make sense. I follow CT, and a lot of times he seems a little out of it. He does a lot of lives in his apartment by himself, kind of drinking, and that seems so not buttoned up, and not what Phaedra would want to be associated with. So I don't know. I really hope I'm wrong, and that they're amazing, and that they really lift each other up. It just feels like there are a couple of fishy things.

And we do know that Atlanta negotiations for casting have not been as cut and dried as Andy would have liked us to believe when he said, "You'll see this cast." Because we heard that Shamea was out. And then we heard that she willingly took a pay cut, and she was spotted filming. So I do see Phaedra upping her game to secure the spot, because she was the only one of them not spotted filming, which tells me she didn't sign a contract, and she's leveraging CT to get herself paid. That's just the business side of Bravo that I sadly have learned too much about. I hope it isn't true, but I think it could be.

That's another very good point. If Shamea coming back leaves less budget, come on.

Todd Tucker's Divorce Documentary and Shamea's RHOA Movie Drama

The Shamea thing really did shock me, because we were told by a source that it's cut, dried, done. She's not coming back. But we did get that crazy email a couple of weeks ago, and I was like, why is this even a thing if she's not going to be back on the show? So thank you to whoever emailed us this. Todd Tucker, Kandi's ex-husband, did put up a post about this, but he took it down. Let me just read the email:

"Todd, Kandi's ex, just put a lot of attention on Shamea just as cameras are filming for Real Housewives of Atlanta for the next season. Last year, Todd released a movie that he produced called Don't Bring Your Man to Atlanta. It wasn't released on a streaming platform and played in very limited locations. Shamea played one of the main characters. Yesterday, Todd released a clip from the movie and spliced it with the statements that Shamea made on Real Housewives of Atlanta saying how this made her husband uncomfortable. Shamea appears to be nude from the waist down and is engaged in pretty intimate behavior. He also posted the full trailer from the movie. It shows Shamea at a sex club, and those who have seen the movie say that the scene is even more graphic. Todd is re-releasing the movie at various theaters around the country. This is definitely going to be a storyline in the next season as the women ask Shamea about her movie role."

And I kept wanting to say the words "soft P-O-R-N," because I think that was in the subject line of the email.

Here's the thing. Based on everything we heard, and then Todd dropping this, and he's friends with Shamea, do I think that Shamea was on the cutting block and secured herself during negotiations? Because the scenes that Todd posted were, remember Skinemax? It was truly simulated sex. It was a lot. But let's talk about Todd for a minute. Because this man is releasing a documentary about his divorce featuring Ralph Pittman and Porsha's baby daddy, Dennis. And it is just shouting thirst. Todd is trying to profit off the demise of his marriage. It does not sit well with me. He's using Real Housewives in these other productions: Shamea, Drew, his divorce. He is using all of the tools in his kit that were given to him by Kandi. It kind of makes you wonder what he'd be doing without her.

Who is he working with at AMC to get these movies released in a movie theater?

Atlanta has its own celebrities. It's kind of like Nashville. There are people we may have heard of peripherally, but if you're in Nashville, they're huge. I think that's how Atlanta is with certain singers or rappers and actresses. There's a whole world that lives in Atlanta that isn't exactly international. It's not worldwide like Kandi.

Clearly the prenup had been really good on Kandi's side. As you're saying this, I did not know about this documentary, and I was shocked to hear it, so I just looked it up while you were talking. It says the self-produced documentary project and film, titled Till Divorce Do Us Part, explores the emotional aftermath of his split with Kandi. And get this: the film hits select theaters and starts a 10-city AMC theater tour in October of 2026. Each stop includes a movie screening, a live Q&A with Todd, and a meet and greet. In the movie, he will talk about the infidelity rumors, he will take a polygraph test, and yes, Ralph and the Hot Dog King will also be in it. So, Cocktailers, deadly serious: who volunteers as tribute to go see this movie and report back? Tell us.

Part of me, if it was in New York, would want to go, but the other part of me doesn't even want to give him the money.

I'm just so curious. But it's research. So one of you is allowed to go. We will Venmo you the price of the ticket. Not more than one. Just tell us before, so you don't all come asking us for Venmos. We need a designated tribute to do this. I agree, though, giving him more money, and this whole polygraph thing. Okay, whatever, buddy.

Could Steven McBee's Ex Allie Eklund Get Her Own Show?

In some other news, this one was really good. A bunch of you Cocktailers took a Bravo Viewer's Voice survey that seemed to indicate that Bravo is considering highlighting Allie Eklund, who is Steven McBee's ex-girlfriend. The person who sent this said it wasn't clear if they're thinking about giving her her own show or if she would somehow be featured on The McBee Dynasty next season. The survey implied that they think the audience is interested in her personal life, her friends, her family, and her life in Texas next season. I find this to be true. I follow her. I really enjoy her content. I like her. I would love to see more of her. I do not want to see her on McBee Dynasty, but could it be Eckhart Dynasty and follow her family? Because she has all these gorgeous sisters. She has a really good-looking dad. They have this big family ranch with the cute animals in Texas. Give them their own show.

I'm so here for it. Yesterday, Amanda forwarded me a story and she said, "The hair transplants are transplanting." And I couldn't see it, so I thought the story had expired. So I went to his page, and I realized that little weak man blocked me. He blocked me. Because why? Because I reposted his nonsense. I'm so here for it. People sent me his story, which now has to be screenshot when you send it to me. Don't worry, you're not some huge star. I won't be talking about you all that much. You want to block me? I'll keep you irrelevant. Know that, Bravolebrities. But his father's getting out of jail on Friday.

Yeah, Papa Crook.

So I envision Daddy filming, the boys filming, Mommy not filming. I am so here for Eckhart Dynasty. Let's showcase female ranchers.

I think you can take the formula of McBee Dynasty that worked so well and apply it to her family. Or maybe as a soft launch to see the fan reaction, they would do a couple of episodes where it went to her. I just don't see her agreeing to be anywhere near him.

I don't think they would have to film together. I think it would zoom to her farm. I know McBee Dynasty has been more and more popular and successful, but it feels to me like they should hedge their bets by looking into a different version of this show, because those boys might be going to jail. How could they film in jail?

Hopefully not. Hopefully justice will be served, and the people who are guilty are guilty, and the people who are innocent are innocent, but right now it's just not looking so good for them.

Agreed. What a fun week. We have so much to look forward to. Watch New York if you haven't. We love you guys. We know there are so many podcasts to listen to, and the fact that you choose us every week is so appreciated. Bye.

What's up, Cocktailers? We want to thank you, as always, for listening to Cocktails and Gossip. Because of you, we've hit some amazing milestones, had some hilarious conversations, and have grown a truly amazing community. If you haven't already followed our podcast, hit the follow button in the top right of your Apple Podcasts player or the follow button under the show logo on Spotify. We thrive on you, our audience, so make sure to tell all your gossip-loving friends about us too. And if you want to get all the tea, join our membership, Cocktail Party, by going to bravoandcocktails.com/join. Our members get access to the exclusive tea we post, the weekly podcast without ads, plus an additional bonus podcast every week. Members also get to join us on our monthly live Cocktail Party Zoom, where we talk about the latest tea and even share tea that's just too hot to put in writing. Last, but maybe best, our members get access to the Cocktail Party Discord, where you can chat with Amanda, me, and all of the other Cocktailers. Thank you so much for listening. We appreciate you.